Aaron Cantu: Most people spend 90 % of their time indoors, I think is what the EPA report had said. And those indoor air quality levels oftentimes can be between two and five times more polluted than the outside air because you're in a bubble. It's concentrated. So when you hear people say like, well, mold is everywhere. It's normal. Well, yeah. But when you're outside, the wind is blowing. The temperature affects it. When you're inside, everything's under concentration. Right? So if you have high levels of mold in that small dwelling, you're going to feel the effects a lot faster than if you were just out at the lake all day.
Aubree Felderhoff: Welcome to Mold Free Mom, where we cut the confusion and break down what it really takes to heal from mold illness. Whether you're dealing with unexplained symptoms and no real answers, or you know mold is your problem, you've done everything right, and yet you're still not better. This podcast is for you. I'm Aubree, and I spent 12 years struggling with mold toxicity. before finally learning why nothing was working. Mold wasn't my only problem. Not knowing how to heal from it was. This is where guessing ends and real healing begins. Let's get started. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Hey, before we get into today's episode, I just wanted to say, if you or someone that you love is dealing with mold illness or symptoms that look like they could be related to mold, and you're not sure where to start, you're feeling overwhelmed with even the thought of what to do next, you don't have to keep piecing this together alone. I offer a free discovery call where we can talk through where you are right now and what would actually help you get unstuck and move towards healing. Head over to moldfreemom.com and grab a free discovery call. See you there. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... I am so excited about today's episode because I have not one, but two incredible guests with me. And honestly, these are people I trust deeply when it comes to the environmental side of mold recovery. First up, I want to introduce to you Harmony Brownwood. Harmony is the founder and CEO of Greenworks Inspections, Engineering and Environmental. And let me tell you, she has set the bar in the inspection industry. What I love about Harmony is that relentless about getting people real answers and she has built her entire company around innovation and actually delivering results, which if you have been in the mold world for any amount of time, you know is rare. And joining her is Aaron Cunto, who serves as the VP of environmental consulting at Greenworks. Aaron is the person you want in your corner when things feel overwhelming. He specializes in mold. indoor air quality, asbestos and environmental consulting. And one of his greatest gifts is taking all of that dense building science and Texas mold regulation and breaking it down into language that families can actually understand and act on. That is huge because so much of what makes mold recovery hard is feeling lost in the technical side of it. Harmony and Aaron I am so grateful to have you both on here today. Welcome to the show.
Harmony Brownwood: for having me on here. Aubree, I greatly appreciate this. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Harmony, why don't we start with you? Can you tell us about your background and how you got started into the space of even developing Greenworks?
Harmony: I was a fifth year student in college trying to pick a major, trying to decide what direction I wanted to go in life. I end up getting online. I am looking for careers that I thought that I could actually be passionate about and have love for. And I end up going through an ebook that's helping me evaluate and decide how to pick a lane. Essentially, the book ends up saying, tell me a little bit about yourself and tell me what it is that you like to do in your free time. Because what they have found is that people who do the things that they love to do naturally, organically, if they can find work somehow related to that space, they're probably going to find that same fulfillment. So I'm like, well, I like watching TV. know, like, what else do you want to know? And they're like, well, even if you like watching TV, what do you like watching on TV? And then what do you leave on the TV when you're not watching TV, but you still just want to listen to it in the background. And everything for me was coming back to HGTV. Well, it out that steered me towards maybe you should look at careers in real estate. So what we want you to do is we want you to ask those people, what is it that they do every single day? You call them up, the realtors, the appraisers, the mortgage lenders and the inspectors and ask them what they do. I spoke to the inspectors and I was like, hi, I'd to know what you do every day. And they start to go, well, yeah, sure. Let me tell you, I get up in the morning. I go to realtor offices. I make my presentation, I tell them about my business, and then if I'm lucky, I get an inspection in the afternoon. And I went, huh? And they're like, yeah, that's what I do. And I went, do you like that? And they were like, no, I hate it. And I went, oh my gosh. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah
Harmony: That's it. I don't know what it was, Aubree but something inside just went off like a light bulb. And I went, that's it. That's it. I got it. I'm going to get work for the home inspectors. Turns out I had no skills for sales and marketing. I had no network. I had no money. I had no real way to know if I was going to be able to do this or not. But I just sat out to do it. That led me onto the journey of failing for 16 months. I tried each and every day to go out and meet people, network with people, but I didn't have what it took, but I was persistent. I just didn't give up. I kept trying, kept trying. I was like, well, they can't say no to me forever. And sure enough, I was right. Eventually, I ended up getting my first client. Then I got my second client four months later. And that second lady, she was a real estate investor. She took me under her wing and she goes, you know what? You're enthusiastic. You have a great attitude. I hear that you're trying to do this. I'm going to introduce you to some people. took six years to get to six inspectors. And then we started really rapidly scaling after that, added in operations and just grew and learned about business from there. And now, fast forward, we're celebrating 15 years this October of actually serving clients and Last year, we served 28,000 customers in the Texas, Denver market. Doing home inspections, environmental testing consulting, and engineering services. And that's what got me into a great relationship with Aaron. And we've been having a good time ever since. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... What a testament, A, to the power of hard work and persistence and B, you Harmony, that's incredible. That's a cool story. So Aaron I want to know a little bit about you. I know you're a integral part of the company, but tell us how you got involved into inspections and environmental inspecting and kind of your story into this.
Harmony: Okay, thank you so much.
Aaron: Yeah, absolutely. It was all by accident. I a maintenance facility, a maintenance department for a production facility and, you know, wanted more and talking with my wife, like again, HDTV, right? We're always watching Fixer Upper and stuff. And I was always pointing out like the things they were doing wrong. And my wife was like, why don't you do that for... Right? why don't you go inspect buildings? I never realized that growing up in the trades, year by year, was learning how to build a house. And so I know what it's supposed to look like when it's done right. And I never connected the dots and realized that could be a career. Didn't know home inspections was a thing. And so I did some research, found a school and So that was my plan. I'm going to start a home inspection company. While I was in school, I read an article on Harmony. think it was her 30 under 30 or 40 under 40 something. Some article came out and they circulated it at the school. I went home and told my wife, if it doesn't work out running our own company, I'm going to work for this lady someday. It wasn't until COVID that I finally got licensed when nobody wants you in your house So I couldn't book a gig. I had a mentor in San Antonio and he wanted me to work for him, but again, COVID was really, really tearing down a lot of companies at that time. He said, look, I can't afford to hire you, but I know a guy that works for a really large company that they might be able to help you out. And so he put me in touch with their acquisitions guy at Greenworks. And I think from the time of the interview to my first day, was maybe like four days. It was pretty fast, easy decision on both parts. And then I was pretty solid. there. I thought I was going to be one of the best home inspectors at Greenworks and make my way up through the ranks. And I started learning the business. I climbed the tiers in the inspection vertical, ⁓ corporate trainer, market leader. All of the inspections that we can do for real estate home inspection, I was doing them. And then I started learning about the environmental vertical that we had that was very small at the time. I it was maybe like three people and then some cross-trained some guys across the state. And so I started learning that and doing that. As we continued to grow, we went through some transitions and bringing in new leaders, phasing out old leaders. And I went into an interview that I thought was going to be a market lead position. like one of the regional managers and our president, Michael said, hey, you can have that job if you want it, but I think you'd be good for this. And so we talked about environmental and At the end of the conversation, I told them, you know, I'd have to learn all the regulations and I'd have to, you know, gain the respect of people that have been doing the job for 30 plus, like as long as I've been dove in and we, grew it over the last four and a half years. We've gone from a two man team to and I think within the 13, we hold an accumulative, like 20 different licenses and different specialties. ⁓ Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, that's a massive undertaking. when you talk about the environmental piece, know, at Mold Free Mom, I'm thinking mold, but I'm assuming there's more that goes into it than that. So what is the environmental envelope? Like what all are you guys looking for and helping to identify in that?
Aaron: Yeah. So mold is always the, hot topic, right? Everybody knows about it and they're scared of it and they don't really fully understand it. So that's always been our, biggest, service. But we also do asbestos inspections for residential and commercial government, radon inspections, which is also like tied into our all encompassing air quality mission. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah.
Aaron: So mold was the thing that we did the most of, and now we're using mold to educate people on the other types of indoor air contaminants that nobody talks about, right? And so that's what we've kind of focused on as the years have gone on is like, how many more answers can we give you? Because sometimes the answer isn't mold. Sometimes it's formaldehyde, sometimes it's radon, sometimes it's something else. Right. And so, we have a full spectrum indoor air quality assessment. do water quality testing. for municipal sources and private water systems. Because again, it's just the lack of education around these things. You assume that when you turn that tap on in your house, you're getting clean water, right? Because you pay a water bill and the city or the state, they supply the water. Surely they're not putting anything in that water that could harm you. it's not to say that they are, but that water, is traveling miles from the treatment plant to your tap. And there's a lot that can happen in that distance, right? And so we think it's important for everybody to actually know, what you're living with to make those decisions because it's a lot of times and you have experience with it. you might feel a certain way for a long period of time and have no idea that you're kind of just like slow dosing yourself with the problem, right? Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Absolutely. Yeah, same with mold. It can be invisible and it often grows in places that we cannot see. so kind of the same idea. We're taking 22,000 breaths a day of a toxin, essentially. So Harmony, I want to go back to you and kind of circle back on, I know when you started the business, you were cold calling these people and you were hearing them tell you what sounds to me terrible. And you were thinking, that's what I want to do.
Aaron: Right.
Harmony: Yeah. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... I love it. But what did you kind of see as you started to get into, especially the environmental side, but home inspections that made you realize you could do it differently? You know, I could do something better here. What was it that kind of sparked that in you that you saw?
Harmony: Yeah, I think I always, you know, kind of looked at things from the client point of view. I still to this day, that's one of my great strengths is I'm always thinking of it. Like, what does this feel like on the other side? You have all these amazing licensed professionals who are thinking about how do they provide a great service if that's working really well in their business or in their minds and they look at the licensing requirements, right? And they learn an SOP and they follow the standard of practice. But what does it translate to for the end user that's intended to have it? So the thing that I wanted to focus on was How are we delivering information? How do we communicate about the information? And what are our clients' experiences going to be once they have this information? What do they feel like? What knowledge do they now have? What actions can they now take once they've hired us and used us to give them a service? And to me, that's the critical step. because we can have the best service in the world, but if it's not delivering what our end client wants to experience and know, then it's not working. And then second, now what are the rules and regulations and licenses that we need to follow to give them that? Like that's kind of like our step two. And then thirdly, let's build a service from there. And ⁓ I think that particular viewpoint has been very, very helpful to us and it's given us a lot to go on and build on from there. And it's so cool because you think about like someone who's experiencing some sort of environmental impact in their house, whether that be that they're. having physical symptoms from it the way that you had to go through that Aubrey or whether they're just seeing something cosmetic in the home that's telling them that something's off like why do these rooms feel this way or why am I seeing some sort of growth on my vents whatever that is it still needs to be solved to get them to the end result and the end solution that they're looking for so that was what I wanted to be I wanted to be the middle I wanted to be this catalyst I wanted to be this bridge that brought these two things together and working from both sides of that, it's paid off very, very well for us. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I think as homeowners too, I've seen this often in the mold world in particular, people will bring inspectors in and they'll identify, yep, that's mold and remove it and not identify why the mold was there, how it got there, you know, the root of what caused it. And then I end up talking to these people later on down the road with the exact same problem because they just brought in an average inspector. that just simply said, yeah, it's mold and we'll remove it and didn't look further. And so you're hitting on something really important as far as more of a comprehensive approach of finding the entire reason that it was there, the entire process of how to remove it and remove it safely is so, so important. So yeah, I'm glad that y'all went that road.
Harmony: Yes. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... So Aaron I know that you have walked through a tremendous amount of homes at this point with all of your certifications and your experience. You've probably seen a gamut of different situations. Is there something about mold that you feel like maybe the general public gets wrong that they're uneducated or just unknowledgeable about that you've seen from experience?
Aaron: I'd say with mold specifically, you kind of touched on it, right? It's like the biggest misconception is that it's always obvious. And a lot of people think like, if I don't see it or smell it, then everything's fine. But like the reality is most of the worst contaminations are going to be hidden, right? Under flooring, inside of a wall, in the HVAC system is a big one. Places people don't look, right? the crawl spaces, the attics. The other thing that people misunderstand quite a bit actually the symptom of a much larger water problem. So if you don't solve that moisture problem, you're fighting that same battle over and over again. It's very common for people to see the mold and have no idea that they even have a water leak until we get out there and do our assessment and actually pinpoint the source of moisture. And then even that conversation just educating them on what actually caused their mold to grow. It's always kind of surprising to see when the dots connect and they're like, ⁓ We didn't know that was causing it, right? That's been dripping for years. And so those are some really big ones is just, think that mold exists everywhere, right? But in the house, it's amplified by things in the house, right? So you can have a normal house, clean it every day. You're still going to have mold there. But it's when you have that underlying condition. that causes the environment for mold to be able to amplify and spread. That's the actual problem. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Absolutely. Yeah, that's a big reason that it's on the rise too is that our homes are getting more and more energy efficient and tighter and you know that building envelope is meant to be Keeping everything in which is great for our electricity bill, but not so much for microbial growth Yeah, yeah, so kind of on that note harmony maybe you can answer this for us have you seen any I don't know like
Aaron: Exactly, yeah. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... dirty little secrets that the typical inspection industry doesn't let the homeowner know about. Have you seen anything that maybe we need to be more educated on?
Harmony: Gosh, I mean, there's so much if you're talking like new construction, there can be a ton on that side of things. Once we, you know, people build new homes and they have no idea that these homes are going through a build that actually is having rain. You know, lots of different contractors coming in. If no one's going in and checking it out, that's a third party. The wood can be getting wet and things can be getting closed up in the home or there can be leaks happening or punctures happening, you name it. That could be causing issues even from like a new construction point of view. And then when an existing home happens, I mean, the reality is, is that things do break and things happen that are unbeknownst to us. Cause we're just in obviously a room and if the function is working as normal, we don't necessarily know that anything's going wrong. But I think that what happens is like from the inspector point of view, when you're going in and you're seeing all these houses and you're looking at these things, it can be incredibly awakening to notice that, hey, this small, innocent condensation line that's dripping outside your window is only, just the, what is that, the second or the third? sign, Aaron, that there is a water source leak happening at the HVAC system, for instance, which could then be a backup.
Aaron: Yeah. Yeah, that's a big one. Like that secondary line that like drips and it's outside, it's always placed in a spot that's visible. And what it's supposed to do is give you the heads up that like, Hey, something's wrong up in the attic or the closet, wherever that HVAC system is. People become so complacent in just living their daily lives that they, they'll look at it and just like, okay, cool, a drip. And they don't put a second thought behind it because again, nobody's educated them on the systems of their home. They don't know that that's supposed to be an alarm to them. They just see it as like that annoying little pipe that sticks out and drips sometimes, you know, like, and so when, when we go out to one of those properties and we see that our first thing is to go up to the attic or the closet, wherever the HRAC unit is. And there's, you know, there's water, standing water in the pan and there's water damage on the, on the drywall and the boards around it. There's mold inside the cabinet. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah.
Aaron: that has all just been allowed to grow and fester because nobody told that homeowner. When that drips, call an HVAC technician because there's a problem. And so it's just, again, it's like a lot of what we do and focus on too is the education of not just like what is mold and why is it there, but the parts of your house that can cause mold if you don't take care of it. I think even in our home inspections, Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah.
Aaron: What sets us apart is that we're calling out everything that we see that might be a problem, even if it's not a problem today. Right. If I go to your house today and it's perfectly mold free, But you have gaps in your windows or you have some structural cracking in your walls or there's air gaps from your attic to your living space. I'm going to call those out to you I'm going to tell you, you should fix those things because there's no mold today. but there might be in three weeks if you don't, right? And so it's just, again, everything that we do is kind of looped back to educating the public on why we're looking at these things. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, I love that. It's a very preventative way of handling. You I would love to have someone come through my home with a clipboard or whatever y'all use and look at every single part of the home and tell me, okay, this is fine now, but here's what could happen. I feel like that should just be industry standard. You know, it just, it just should be something every homeowner does is to have someone that's able to come with a third eye that's trained and educated in this and look so that we prevent.
Aaron: Right. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... further down the line this massive problem that then has grown and caused, health issues. So kind of on that note, Aaron, after, visiting probably at this point, what, thousands of homes, what is something that you see that you can identify over and over that maybe a family never realizes is an actual problem? You know, like One example that you gave us was that air conditioning drip, which we actually personally have experienced that when we bought this home and moved in, we had that pipe that was just blowing water down the back of our house. And luckily we had a little bit of education into that and called the HVAC. And there was a problem, you were right. But what's something else that, you know, until that point, I had no idea that that was, like you said, I had no idea that was an alarm bell. So what are some other things that you see that homeowners have no clue about?
Aaron: Yeah, there's a lot of things. So in most homes, when you see mold, it's usually going to be due to like a plumbing leak, a roof leak, or an HVAC problem. More often than not in Texas, it's an HVAC problem, right? Or at least exacerbated by the HVAC system. And so again, it kind of just goes back to like people not really understanding what the HVAC system is there to do. and they think air conditioning, ⁓ it makes it hot and it makes it cold and it makes me comfortable. But it's also your humidity control because mold likes to grow at anything over 50 % relative humidity. Your HVAC system is designed to keep those humidity levels lower, keep the air cleaner right through filtration. And to also keep down the byproducts of just being a human, right? It filters out your carbon dioxide and stuff. And so when we go into a house, I'm taking constant carbon dioxide readings. And when I see an elevated number, I know that this room isn't getting sufficient air conditioning, right? The air is not properly conditioned in this room. And so it gives me clues along the way that kind of almost always... point back to that HVAC system. But then it's getting them to understand that like, hey, this is what this thing is supposed to do. And this is where it's failing. unfortunately for the client, a lot of times we go in after it's already pretty bad. And so it's beyond just call an HVAC guy to maintenance the machine. It's now you have to do a protocol and remediation and get all of that stuff out of there. so that you can do some maintenance on your HVAC and get that home back to a healthy baseline. There's also things like air purifiers and humidifiers and dehumidifiers. All of those things are very popular now, which are not bad products. They're very useful if you use them appropriately. But a lot of them are also water-based. They use a water reservoir in them. And people like the set it and forget it. methodology, right? Where they just, turn it on and it's going to make my house perfect. And I never have to worry about it again. And then we go in and there's a musty odor and it's only in the rooms that have these devices. And we open up the devices and it's a giant Petri dish because they've never changed the water. Right. And so again, it's just kind of, it's, it's people in general, we look for like the easy conveniences and what makes my life better. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... You
Aaron: but we don't really think past that. Is there anything I need to do to maintain this to ensure that it remains a convenience and not a hindrance to my growth? I've also seen plants. People love indoor plants and they're great. There's lots of studies that say having indoor plants is great for your health. and helping that indoor air kind of stay in a really healthy baseline. But if you have 50 plants in a 700 square foot apartment and you overwater them, well, the mulch in the soil is now a petri dish for mold and you're gonna start to grow other types of life forms that you didn't want in that house, right? So it's just... Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Hmm. you
Aaron: We I like to go through the house and really understand like how do that? How do those people live in the house so that I understand is there anything sometimes the house is not contributing to it sometimes the person is contributing to to the problem, right and That's like the best case scenario I like when that happens because I can tell them like hey, you know go Clean out your soil like maybe reduce the plants. You can do these things and not have to undertake Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah.
Aaron: tens of thousands of dollars in mold remediation and just kind of correct your actions day to day to help that home kind of remain healthy. But then there is also the building science behind it, right? Sometimes there's a problem with the building itself and those are the more drastic cases. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, yeah, that's an interesting ⁓ thought that I hadn't thought of, Aaron is sometimes it is the homeowner that is contributing to certain situations, you know.
Aaron: Right. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... I'm a lover of plants. I'm sure you can see the plant in my background. And I've had situations like that too, where I've noticed, I love to overwater my plants as well. And I've had to stop because my soil got disgusting and moldy and that is not good. know, it's doing the opposite of what I'm intending for it in my home. So that's an, and I would love, I would love for one of my inspections to have just been that I was overwatering my plants. never unfortunately turned out that way for us.
Aaron: Right, yeah. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... That would be fantastic news that it's just a, you know, simply remove some plants and move on. So Harmony, I want to ask you, is there ever a maybe question that a homeowner should be asking their inspection company that would change what's found versus what gets missed? Have you seen that? Like, is it ever on the homeowner to be educated on how they're presenting information?
Aaron: Right.
Harmony: You know, it's always great if a homeowner is educated and they kind of have an understanding of What is this person coming in and evaluating? ⁓ What are some of the things that I should be looking out for when I'm actually hiring a professional because so often than not we find that our best clients kind of have that knowledge and understanding of what it is that they should be looking at. We get the people are busy. This is not their profession. And so we want them to completely rely on us. But we do want to go in and we want to give this incredibly comprehensive assessment. And like Aaron said, If we can make it personalized and understand like what some of the family needs are and what it is that their experiences are, what particular maybe health experiences that they've had in the past or what are they looking for in the future, it just helps us give a more specific customized experience to them. And so it's great when people know what it is that we are trying to do and then how we can help them achieve the solution and the results that they're looking for. So like one of the big things is, you know, if they just basically understand like mold cannot grow without moisture, like that's a big deal. if they simply have that understanding. we've gone into homes where they have these beautiful large trees in the yards and they have all of this greenery growing up the side of the house or they have a pool, that's outside and it's lush and it's green. It's really shaded, our inspectors are looking at this and already like their wheels are turning. They're already thinking about, how is the watering and the landscaping and the sprinkler system impacting this home in particular? if we can understand and know what are your goals, what are you looking for, and then how do we help you do it in a responsible way that's going to keep you and your family safe and happy. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, absolutely. That's something I have found very overwhelming as a homeowner. the more that I know, the more I don't know. I'm learning I don't know and I have to learn of just like you said, you know, the landscaping outside. Just the other day we were looking, my husband and were looking at a wall outside that is just a blank wall, you know, on that exterior of our home. And I was saying, I really want some sort of beautiful flower, something to break this wall up. And he said, well, why don't we grow these vines up the wall? And I'm like, I don't think that that's a good idea. But you don't know what you don't know. And so it really takes a team like you guys, and hats off to y'all for coming in and educating, not just finding the source of the problem, but educating and helping to prevent, hopefully. homeowners for making mistakes in the future that can contribute. That is probably where you guys are differentiated from so many other companies is that there's that education piece of helping, ideally working you out of a job. I know that's not gonna happen, preventing the mold and the water intrusion in the first place would be the ideal situation. So Aaron can you tell us, without naming any specifics or names, has there ever been a home that you've walked into where everyone had told the family that the home was fine, everything was perfect, there was no mold, there was nothing causing symptoms, and what you actually found upon further investigation? I know I've been in a situation where I've had an inspector come in and tell us everything was fine and it was not fine. So I'm sure you've had those stories.
Aaron: Countless stories. Yeah. One that sticks with me actually is pretty recent and it's an ongoing project, but they had a home inspection done that had called out some latent water damage and the home owner or the buyer of the home has very young children and one of them is immunocompromised. And so we're already very suspicious and concerned about mold and indoor air quality. They hired a different company before us and they went out and did a mold inspection, ran a bunch of air samples, told them, hey, everything looks good. It's a 1970s home, but it's fully renovated. Everything's updated. Like you're good to go. There's not a problem here, right? They went in a couple of days later. The house had been vacant for a couple of days. The A-Track system was turned off. They walked in and... were smacked in the face with a musty odor. And so they're like, well, let's get a second opinion. Thankfully we were that second opinion. And I went out there and was kind of, again, knowing that the building was a 75, having done electrical work and carpentry and remodels, like I know the industry corners that get cut because it was like, I hate to admit it, but it was my job to cut those corners as a young kid in the trades, right? Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah. Yes.
Aaron: they incentivize that, you know? And so I know how houses are flipped. And I went in there with just like my eagle eyes on, right? Like looking for the telltale signs. When I got there, I didn't smell the smell that he had mentioned. And the HVAC system was running and house was cool and comfortable. And so I started looking around and, you know, they smelled it in two distinct areas. One was the primary bathroom and one was what used to be a laundry room, but then they converted it to like a mud room kind of like entry from the back, from the pool area. And so I was asking about, you know, how did the last assessment go? What did they look at? What did they find? I don't like to review outside reports, nothing against any other multi-consultant out there. I just don't want to be... like influenced with someone else's opinion or observations. So sometimes I'll look at it afterwards, but never before my assessment. So I'm asking him questions about the laundry room. Does he know how the plumbing lines were rerouted because they obviously changed the plumbing path for some of these fixtures. And then I asked him, did he go into the garage? And he said, well, no, because he explained it to us that that's not a habitable space. So it's not under. You know, the Texas regulations, they don't have to do that. And I said, okay, well, I'm still going to do that. And I'm going to go in the attic and I'm going to do all the things. so I started walking around and I walk outside, of the garage and I see, drain line, leaky, right. It's dripping onto the ground. I trace it back to the attic. It is supposed to be the secondary drain line, right? So it's supposed to be that alarm that tells you something's wrong. When they reconfigured the floor plan of the house, they didn't have anywhere to put the primary drain because it usually goes to this first plumbing fixture to drain under the sink. They didn't have access to that anymore. So they made the secondary drain line, the primary drain line. So now that thing is constantly pumping water out on the concrete that is flush with the exterior wall. And I went into the garage that was just on the other side of that and found Again, I couldn't see water damage. I couldn't see any obvious indications, but in that corner, I found a pile of peel bugs, little roly-polies. And I said, that's weird because they're alive, right? They're not dried out from the heat of the garage. So I busted out my infrared camera and the whole wall is saturated. The original consultant never thought to look at it because he didn't need to. Right. He didn't have to do it. And so we moisture mapped that garage wall. It ended up being a full wall and a half and then all the way up to the attic because it had been that long of a saturation event. And that wood inside that wall just sucks it up like a straw, right? For as long as there's water there, it'll continue to suck it up. So we got that one done and he was like, wow, that's like, you found it because of bugs. And I said, well, I know that those little bugs like moisture, like they like to live in cool, wet dirt. And so I knew that there was something off there. And so I was able to kind of find that by just taking a little bit extra of an investigative approach to it. And then also knowing like how the house systems work. So he was pleased. He was like, we found everything we needed. And I said, well, we still got to go address that other side of the house. Cause I didn't smell the smell over there. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Thanks.
Aaron: You walk over there and I've been in the house for a couple hours now. And again, didn't smell anything there, but I made a note that when I was in there, they have a skylight and they had this weird like faux plaster finish. And so you couldn't see anything through the finish with your infrared camera because of the type of finish that it was. But when we went in the second time after the sun had come over the house and it was now hitting directly on that skylight, the smell was there. And I said, ⁓ you need a a roofer to get up there and check those penetrations to make sure that there's not water leaking. And you're going to have to open up that ceiling because I think what's happening is the heat is heating. The sun is heating up that area and it's really see it's, it's activating the spores. They're kind of, they're jumping around now cause they're warm. and sure enough, they opened up that ceiling. he texted me two days ago and there's like, he were right. whole bathroom ceiling is covered in mold. ⁓ But it's just that like when it's easy to go into a house and say, yup, looks good, air checks out as opposed to just spending a little bit more time there. I have the luxury of like being the VP. So when I go into the field, I can set aside multiple hours or a whole day to go spend with the client. And I understand that like a lot of inspectors don't have that. but you should have some aspect of that built into your assessments. Our guys are trained to lean into the consultant side of being a mold consultant. And so even after the fact like, hey, if we were only there for two hours and we didn't smell the smell, but then it came back later, let's go back out and check it out. Right? What were the conditions when you did identify that so that I can try to go back under those same conditions and see if I can find something else. Right. And again, it's just, I could have gone in there and said the exact same thing because the house was beautiful. It was fully renovated. It looked amazing. It looked like a magazine. But I just, I knew that there was something there, I knew that there was more to look at than just the magazine cover, you had to look behind the cover, but we have a lot of stories like that, But now, every time that guy looks at another house, he's going to be looking through it through a different lens. And that's the goal, right? Because I love my job, but the ideal situation is that I don't have to do this job, right? I teach you to do the job. And now more people are aware and they can kind of catch onto that. Because when you're buying a house or you're renting a new apartment. It's very hard to take those rose colored glasses off when you're in the middle of that transaction because this is what you want and it checks all the boxes and you're only thinking about the idealistic, like the romanticized view of what that home is going to do for you, not what's actually there living with you when you move in, you know. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yes. Yeah, that's huge. And I'm wondering how often that happens, that a home is entirely changed structurally, like what you're talking about, a renovated home, and those types of things go on. And yet the home, the bones of it look gorgeous. And you're like, there's nothing wrong. Everything is brand new. But then, like you said, this whole wall, all the way up to the attic is saturated.
Aaron: Yeah. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... because of the main drip line was not changed. mean, it's just, it's sad, but I bet it happens more than we realize, you know, or we're starting to realize.
Aaron: Yeah, I think it does, especially with those fast renovations, you know, when they're, and sometimes it's not, you know, I mean, I don't think it's ever malicious, right? But it's, it's, just things happen, right? When you're reconfiguring plumbing lines or even moving the foundation to repair it, you're running the risk of penetrating a plumbing line that you can't see because you can't see through the wall. Right? So if you're adding an anchor bolt somewhere, you might just barely nick a plumbing line. And now you have a constant stream of water in that. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Mm-hmm.
Aaron: wall that you're not going to find until three years later when it's really bad. Same thing for the drainage lines. We've seen drainage line related mold issues where the house was moved to be leveled again and it separated a drain line, which is even worse than just mold because now you're talking about sewage gas and stuff in your house. Even that, just that latent humidity from the sewer gas into your wall or your attic. wherever it is, can cause a lot of problems that go undetected for a long time. even that, consider like the homeowner that moves into an older house and then, you know, three months later, they start to smell this intermittent, like stinky little smell. Well, a lot of people will just assume like, well, old house, you know, it's going to creak, it's going to smell, you know, it's just, that's just the way it is. You know, I bought a seventies home. That's what I was, that was a I knew what I was getting into, right? But it's not always like, whether the house was built yesterday or the house was built in 1965, if it's well maintained, it shouldn't just randomly smell. crazy that we see it so often, but I like the opportunities to go out there and have this conversation with those clients because that's... one less time I'll ever have to have that conversation, you know? Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yes. Yeah. Knowledge is power. Yeah. So for our final question, kind of piggybacking off of what Aaron said, Harmony, what is something that you feel every family should know before they rent or renovate or even purchase a new home? Like what is something that you wish they knew, that you see families don't know, you know, in this industry?
Harmony: Yeah, I I would definitely say do not miss out on the opportunity to do full evaluation when you're buying a new home. really sincerely feel that air quality and health, it's not really a luxury anymore. It is something that you really need to know about because what you don't know today and what you're not. getting an assessment of today can definitely come later down the line and cause major problems you want to definitely look at the health investment and the knowledge. it's amazing how when we're preventative, we never see the benefit of the things that we prevented in the future, right? So we kind of take that money spent today approach and saving. But reality is, that un. Spoken undo stress harm time away from family time away from doing the things that we want to do You know effects on our health and our biology, you know, we don't get those things back. So make the decision to take the time do the evaluation spend the money because can we do preventative work that leaves us knowing that we have at least tried all that we can to set ourselves up for the future life that we want to have. I think that's like the biggest thing that I could give to anyone is, and this happens to be the space that I'm in, but I live it every single day, you know, like every single time I can make a good choice. I try to take the good right choice that I can because I'm putting myself one step closer. And yes, trusting professionals like, You do want to do assessments. You do want to trust professionals do your own homework as well You know listen the podcast like this. It's amazing how much knowledge you can gain By just listening in and learning as you go and being able to share that information with others, too we want to put a village around us So, share this podcast with someone else, You hear people having a conversation and they say that they keep getting sick, maybe just ask little questions here and there that can help someone else out along the way because all of this good can spread faster and we can obviously all help each other on this journey we call life so that that's my one one gift Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Okay, that's philosophical, but you're so right. I mean, it's a great point. You don't think about what you're actually saving, not just financially, but mentally, spiritually. Time-wise, when you do the preventative work, because it never comes to fruition that something negative would happen if you prevent it, right? But we only look at it if we have a mold issue or we have to do this massive remediation and we have all these other things, but... Think about if you just spent a small portion of the money and time to do it the right way and to have someone like you guys come in and inspect that home thoroughly and make sure that it's safe for a family to enter and to live in, you'll never get to the other end, hopefully, unless there's something, you know, like you have moldy plants, right, Aaron unless there's something bad going on later on, but you could save yourself life, you know? And we...
Aaron: Yeah. Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... We can get money back, we can get other things back, we'll never get time back. That's the one commodity we can never make more of. So it's so important to do the work ahead of time. I love that harmony. Perfect ending. You guys have been wonderful. I've enjoyed every minute of this. And I know that my listeners, a lot of them are local in Texas. And so they probably want to know where they can get in touch with you guys
Harmony: Thank
Aaron: the website is going to be the easiest, Greenworksinspections.com. We're on Facebook, we're on Instagram. Harmony's got her on Instagram. I'm a little bit of a ninja when it comes to getting ahold of in the social platforms, but when it comes to like relationships, clients can email me directly. I talk to clients directly every day. Setting them up with what they need. That's the kind of conversation I love to have Aubree Felderhoff | Mold Fr... Yeah, and I'll have all of y'all's contact information linked in the show notes for people that are looking. well, thank you both, Aaron and Harmony. I've learned a ton and I've really enjoyed this.
Harmony: Thank you so much for having us. It's been awesome. I
Aaron: Thank you for having this.
Aubree: Thanks for listening to Mold Free Mom. If this episode has helped you make sense of some of your symptoms, diagnoses, or why nothing has worked in the past, please make sure to follow the show and leave a quick review so others who are struggling can find it quicker. If this episode brought someone struggling with unexplained sickness or mold to mind, please share it so they don't have to waste years of their life chasing the wrong answers like I did. Remember, you're not broken. You can get your life back. You just need to be shown how.
